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</head><body><p>I DIY electronics and play a bit of music. I set my heart on a modular system in the early 80s, however it never happened at that time. <br></p><p>I never considered 5U then and certainly not now. Waaay to big and grotesque. Frac is deader than dead in the UK/Europe. Wiard and Buchla are interesting but quirky (sorry Cary/Grant!). Bugbrand was of interest, but unobtanium. Eurorack is the only format that makes sense for me, I want/need to gig a polyphonic musical system that I can get tunes from without having to own a warehouse to store it all in with 3 articulated lorries plus a 747 just to port it around, which is what you need logistically for a single voice in 5U.<br></p><p>Boxed headers, when utilised correctly (here's looking at you Jomox) with keyed IDC cables works for me. Safe as houses. If you f**k up with those , then may be you should not be playing the game.<br></p><p>I do suffer a mix of 2.5/3mm rails, as when I first started I was kindly sent a number of older Rittal rails from Austria FOC, courtesy of Peter Ullrich. I am ever grateful for that gesture, though my bank balance isn't due to the number of Euro modules I now own. <br></p><p>cheers and regards<br></p><p><br></p><p>Paul<br></p><blockquote type="cite"><div id="ox-0947b2d903" style="word-wrap: break-word;" class="">On 26 October 2017 at 06:05 Terry Shultz <thx1138@earthlink.net> wrote:<br><br><a href="https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a3_t1_20&qi=cg7X2SgS3eE8LHLKDlVGtqpJeCU_1497963026_1:49:15&bq=author=john%20black&title=system%20engineers%20handbook%20guide%20to%20building%20vme%20and%20vxi%20systems%20the%20morgan%20kaufmann%20series%20in%20computer%20architecture%20and%20design" class="">https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a3_t1_20&qi=cg7X2SgS3eE8LHLKDlVGtqpJeCU_1497963026_1:49:15&bq=author%3Djohn%2520black%26title%3Dsystem%2520engineers%2520handbook%2520guide%2520to%2520building%2520vme%2520and%2520vxi%2520systems%2520the%2520morgan%2520kaufmann%2520series%2520in%2520computer%2520architecture%2520and%2520design</a><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Look for John Black, I worked at Motorola with John back in the 1980’s</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">regards,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Terry<br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite"><div class="">Begin forwarded message:</div><br class="ox-0947b2d903-Apple-interchange-newline"><div style="margin: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">From: </strong></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">Terry Shultz <<a href="mailto:thx1138@earthlink.net" class="">thx1138@earthlink.net</a>><br class=""></span></div><div style="margin: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">Subject: </strong></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">Re: [sdiy] Euro Synth Spec</strong><br class=""></span></div><div style="margin: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">Date: </strong></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">October 25, 2017 at 9:58:26 PM PDT<br class=""></span></div><div style="margin: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">To: </strong></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">"<a href="mailto:Synth-diy@synth-diy.org" class="">Synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a>" <<a href="mailto:synth-diy@synth-diy.org" class="">synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a>><br class=""></span></div><div style="margin: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class="">Cc: </strong></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">john slee <<a href="mailto:indigoid@oldcorollas.org" class="">indigoid@oldcorollas.org</a>><br class=""></span></div><br class=""><div class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word;" class=""><a href="https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a1_t1_1&qi=BBFs4B.kBpDkx69MMQLqhdnO6IU_1497963026_1:1:1&bq=author=dirk%20hesse&title=eurocard%20din%2041612%20connector%20design%20application%20%26%20systems" class="">https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a1_t1_1&qi=BBFs4B.kBpDkx69MMQLqhdnO6IU_1497963026_1:1:1&bq=author%3Ddirk%2520hesse%26title%3Deurocard%2520din%252041612%2520connector%2520design%2520application%2520%2526%2520systems</a><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I found 3 of the books on the search that I am listing here. ISBN 3-922120-76-8 by Dirk Hesse .</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Also try searching DIN 41612, IEC 603-2, or IEC 48D.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">These are the specs that Eurorack should adhere to for standardization in my small opinion.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I actually have this book from my days working at Motorola and I build my Eurorack prototypes.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I am now looking at 5U as a better cabinet format but I have some thinking to do on this matter.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The Moog guys had a method and it worked for them.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Still I apologize if I bent any feelings on the thread of discussions.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">regards,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Terry</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""><div class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div class="">On Oct 25, 2017, at 9:31 PM, Terry Shultz <<a href="mailto:thx1138@earthlink.net" class="">thx1138@earthlink.net</a>> wrote:</div><br class="ox-0947b2d903-Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word;" class="">Interesting that so much discussion on this Power supply and protection.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Having Worked at Motorola Systems designing projects with VME (VersaModule Euro) we used Schroff for custom chassis.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Pentair has acquired Schroff some time back.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We never had issues on how to build systems as it was clearly laid out in a book printed by Schroff.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">It is based on standards that stood the test of time and somehow EuroRack did not follow in the footsteps of VME.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I just crack up on some of the issues that are flogged to death in this area.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Perhaps it is time to put together a spec. that adheres to the ISO safety standards and common sense school of thought.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We are beating this topic to death I fear, but that is just my 2 pfennigs.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Terry<br class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div class="">On Oct 25, 2017, at 3:52 PM, Jason Proctor <<a href="mailto:jason@redfish.net" class="">jason@redfish.net</a>> wrote:</div><br class="ox-0947b2d903-Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">to be fair, all of those situations (with the exception of the Mungo/Hinton thing, perchance) happen on 5U. the difference isn't the technical standard, it's the sheer number of different kinds of people using the gear.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">5U = real synth nerds</div><div class="">Euro = literally everyone vaguely interested in modular</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">standards aren't going to help you with your inrush current. even real nerds can get that wrong :-)</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">but i do curse the Euro power connector every time i install or remove a module in my synth, for sure.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><div class="ox-0947b2d903-gmail_extra"><br class=""><div class="ox-0947b2d903-gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 2:44 PM, john slee <span class=""><<a href="mailto:indigoid@oldcorollas.org" target="_blank" class="">indigoid@oldcorollas.org</a>></span> wrote:<br class=""><blockquote><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="">How do you like the nearly-daily threads on the MuffWiggler Euro forum about one or more of the below?<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">* why is there hum in my recordings</div><div class="">* halp my recordings are noisy</div><div class="">* my Radio Music fails to power up the first time I switch the power on but the second time it's fine whyyyy</div><div class="">* I added <something> to my system and now <something else> isn't working</div><div class="">* some random power supply issue leading to yet another flamewar between Mungo/Graham Hinton</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">That's not really what I have in mind when I think of spectacular synth-laden Serengeti safaris.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I had a quick browse through a few pages of the 5u forum threads and spotted nothing obviously like this. Not to say that it's not there... but it wasn't painfully obvious like it is in the Euro forum.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Let's hope that this Euro "standards committee" actually has a positive impact on things.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">John</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="ox-0947b2d903-gmail_extra"><br class=""><div class="ox-0947b2d903-gmail_quote"><span class="">On 21 October 2017 at 06:57, Tim Ressel <span class=""><<a href="mailto:timr@circuitabbey.com" target="_blank" class="">timr@circuitabbey.com</a>></span> wrote:<br class=""></span><div class=""><div class="ox-0947b2d903-h5"><blockquote><div class=""><p class="">Roman has a point, up to a point. Eurorack certainly has its problems. Roman didn't even mention the 12V rails, where 15V is so much better. But it also has its charms. <br class=""></p><p class="">It sounds like Roman is against Eurorack, and that is fine. There are other formats, like 5U for example. There you have only 2 different power connectors versus the inferior one choice for Eurorack. Also fixed width panels that always seem to be too small or too big. But at least the panels are black and 1/4" jacks are so kewl and there is a spec for the font. Oh, wait... <br class=""></p><p class="">This came up several years ago on my modules. I did extensive testing and found the font doesn't affect the sound at all. <br class=""></p><p class="">I've never seen panels other than the usual 1.6mm, so no sure about that. Sliding nuts are a great way to torture prisoners of war. Heck, even my friend Jeph who swore by sliding nuts changed his mind when he got a case with nut strips. Of course there is a way to fix the sliding nut issue: fill the rails all the way up with nuts, then remove 1 nut for wiggle room. Rails with or without lip, I have both, don't care either way. As for screws, yes, three different sizes is a pain in the posterior. But screws are cheap and so are Altoids cans. <br class=""></p><p class="">And by the way, I have a standard jack color: It is silver ;-)<br class=""></p>I should also point out that there are standards for Eurorack:<br class=""> <a class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.doepfer.de/a100_man/a100m_e.htm" target="_blank">http://www.doepfer.de/a100_man<wbr class=""/>/a100m_e.htm</a><br class=""> <a class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.doepfer.de/a100_man/a100t_e.htm" target="_blank">http://www.doepfer.de/a100_man<wbr class=""/>/a100t_e.htm</a><br class=""> <br class=""> Sadly, no spec for the font. <br class=""> <br class=""> Perhaps Roman should consider founding a new format. It sounds like he has strong opinions on how things outta be. For me though, a format that has rigid standards for every last little thing sounds like going to the zoo: see the animals safely behind cages, no risk of anything going wrong, eat some popcorn. I prefer a safari on the Serengeti: Not so safe, never know which guide you're going to get, my get eaten by a lion. That's what Eurorack is like.<br class=""> <br class=""> --Timbo<div class=""><div class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540h5"><br class=""> <br class=""><div class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878moz-cite-prefix">On 10/20/2017 11:45 AM, Roman wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite"><div class="">Why bother with color jacks since whole eurorack is a mess!<br class=""></div><div class="">Power source - no specs at all, power cable - crap, power connector - mistake, mounting screws - M3 or M2.5 or inch-something, various rail types resulting in different srew lenght requirement, rails with or without lip, mounting holes in if full HP or half-HP location, sliding nuts - insanity, panel thickness and materials, from 1 to 5mm, and I haven't even touched CV ranges, neither in/out impedances, this list can go on and on.<br class=""></div><div class="">And anybody considering standarize jack colors? Gimme a break. How about uniform font?<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Roman<br class=""></div><div class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878nh_extra"><p class="">Dnia 20 października 2017 19:39 Quincas Moreira <a class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:quincas@gmail.com" target="_blank"><quincas@gmail.com></a> napisał(a):<br class=""></p><blockquote><div id="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878gwp85c9da6d" class=""><div class="">I think I prefer the way Random Source does the Serge colour coding in Euro, it goes on the panel rather than on the jack. just a coloured circle around each jack. And keep it simple, just red, black and blue, more becomes messy, IMo<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Sent from my iPad<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote><div class="">On Oct 20, 2017, at 11:41 AM, Vladimir Pantelic <a class="ox-0947b2d903-m_7263291731352640540m_-3983325297367860878moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vladoman@gmail.com" target="_blank"><vladoman@gmail.com></a> wrote:<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">except for the Doepfer range, no other module I have uses these right angle Cliff jacks. And I don't even know where to buy the colored version from.<br class=""></div><div class="">so unless I do full color print panels, I see not way to implement this scheme even if I wanted.<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote><div class="">On 10/20/2017 06:05 PM, Andre Majorel wrote:<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="http://www.elby-designs.com/webtek/panther/panther-jacks.htm" target="_blank" class="">http://www.elby-designs.com/we<wbr class=""/>btek/panther/panther-jacks.htm</a><br class=""></div><div class="">I think that it would make panels look like angry fruit salads<br class=""></div><div class="">and that might be counter-productive. A quick way to tell<br class=""></div><div class="">outputs from inputs would be nice, though. Something like the<br class=""></div><div class="">Cwejman S1 but using brightness rather than hue. Eg white for<br class=""></div><div class="">outputs, black for inputs.<br class=""></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">______________________________<wbr class=""/>_________________<br class=""></div><div class="">Synth-diy mailing list<br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="mailto:Synth-diy@synth-diy.org" target="_blank" class="">Synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="http://synth-diy.org/mailman/listinfo/synth-diy" target="_blank" class="">http://synth-diy.org/mailman/l<wbr class=""/>istinfo/synth-diy</a><br class=""></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">______________________________<wbr class=""/>_________________<br class=""></div><div class="">Synth-diy mailing list<br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="mailto:Synth-diy@synth-diy.org" target="_blank" class="">Synth-diy@synth-diy.org</a><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="http://synth-diy.org/mailman/listinfo/synth-diy" target="_blank" class="">http://synth-diy.org/mailman/l<wbr class=""/>istinfo/synth-diy</a><br class=""></div></div></blockquote></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><br class=""> <br class=""><pre class="">______________________________<wbr class=""/>_________________
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--Tim Ressel
Circuit Abbey
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