[sdiy] Digital accumulator VCO core?

Eric Schlappi eric.schlappi at gmail.com
Wed Feb 10 00:27:13 CET 2021


The ice40 chips are pretty low power and come in lqfp and you can certainly
do all the other things you mentioned.

Debugging is not fun though, writing testbenches for everything is not as
easy as just stepping through the code, though if you put time into
learning formal verification it seems to help a lot. I can only speak from
the yosys/nextpnr workflow.

The FPGA opens a lot of options as long as you can visualize the logic
structures you are instantiating. Still learning about which things are
better to use a microcontroller (or softcore) and which should be built in
logic.


On Tue, Feb 9, 2021 at 3:16 PM Brian Willoughby <brianw at audiobanshee.com>
wrote:

> Those are good points, Eric.
>
> Another downside of FPGA designs is that they can consume a lot more power
> than a purpose-built DSP. They're certainly all the rage right now, but
> that doesn't guarantee that they're the best choice.
>
> Companies like Texas Instruments make DSP chips like the TMS320 C5000
> family that can run quite a while on battery power. They've been
> fine-tuning the transistor count for signal processing for decades, and you
> can get quite a lot of parallel processing going on - literally parallel,
> not just multi-tasking - to solve signal processing challenges. They have
> timers, DMA, synchronous serial ports for digital audio streams and
> ADC/DAC/CODEC interfacing, and five separate busses for read and write
> access to multiple memory banks. It's amazing how much data can be moving
> around without software interaction, while still having code handling the
> complex parts.
>
> Another positive for DSP chips is that they can be obtained in packages
> like LQFP that aren't as problematic as BGA or QFN.
>
> Personally, I find it much easier to design with a part where I can write
> in a language that allows stepping through the code and quick iteration of
> ideas. Texas Instruments has JTAG interfaces that allow you to graph time
> domain and frequency domain signals within the chip memory in real time.
> I'm not aware of tools for FPGA that allow so much debugging support.
>
> Brian
>
>
> On Feb 9, 2021, at 12:23, Eric Brombaugh wrote:
> > Interesting idea. The trouble is that there are a few downsides to
> > typical modern FPGAs that make them hard to integrate as a pre-
> > programmed drop-in parts. Most FPGAs require some sort of external non-
> > volatile configuration memory, plus multiple supply voltages, clock
> > oscillators and are typically only available in SMT packages.
> >
> > The particular Lattice parts I've been using lately do have on-chip NV
> > memory so they could be delivered pre-programmed, but they require 3.3V
> > and 1.8V supplies and come only in BGA or QFN packages. For most DIY
> > folks that means an assembled DIP module would probably be most user-
> > friendly.
> >
> > One other downside is that it's difficult to do an accurate 12-bit ADC
> > using only resources on most FPGAs. I have done lower resolution ADCs
> > using PWM and comparators, but they're pretty slow and noisy so the
> > control voltage input for a digital oscillator would need an external
> > accuate ADC for best results.
> >
> > Overall, a pre-engineered FPGA solution can be done, but there would be
> > some trade-offs.
> >
> > Eric
> >
> > On Tue, 2021-02-09 at 14:11 -0500, Aaron B. wrote:
> >>
> >> I would absolutely buy FPGAs preprogrammed as sawtooth-only DCOs
> >> like this, and build analog waveshapers around them. Sounds like a good
> >> compromise across sound quality, tracking/temperature stability, parts
> >> count, and ease of tuning.
>
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