[sdiy] harmonics & vibrato - drums

[harrybissell]

OK... for a loser drummer like me... I record into Cakewalk with no
quantization, then apply about a 75% 'pull' to the nearest selected
beat (usually eight-note triplets or so)... this makes my tracks somewhat
de-humanized by getting the precision I wish I had.

Who ever posted they could hit around +/- 2/384 with an HR-16 is NOT
a human at all imho... but a alien to be feared and reconned with  ;^P
(ie thats DAMN good ever for a pro drummer - I don't care WHAT the
tempo is...cause its as hard to play slow, as fast...)

H^) harry

Scott Gravenhorst wrote:

> Hmm.  First, I'm here to learn.
>
> This is a very interesting topic since I like to sequence and have no drum set and couldn't play it
> if I had it.  I had always looked at a human drummer as something that physically cannot have
> quartz crystal tempo perfection.  To my way of understanding, that means that a "good" drummer will
> hit very close to on the beat (or _consistently_ ahead/behind for feel as Harry said), but being
> human, cannot achieve absolute perfection at this.  The actual beat accuracy would, I think, look
> like a bell curve where the peak is at the desired timing point.  The better the drummer, the
> narrower s/he can make this bell curve (if that's desired) and the more accurately s/he can align
> the peak with the desired timing.  I could only best describe the data on both sides of this bell
> curve peak as "random".  It was this thinking that first made me try weighted random distribution
> of beat accuracy in my sequencing.  Instantly, a piece that sounded robotic and mechanical (from
> quantization) sounded more pleasant, erm more "human".  However as some have pointed out, there are
> other factors besides beat accuracy variation such as slight variation in striking strength
> (velocity) and variations in drum timbre due to different parts of the surface being struck.  The
> drum sounds I use are not analog, so I'm stuck with the control I get from the sound module (Roland
> U-110).  Unfortunately, I can't do anything to make subtle timbre changes, but I can certainly
> control velocity, which affects amplitude.  I suppose this is the tradeoff between sampled drum
> sounds and real analog electronic drums.
>
> Are there any really good analog drum synth circuits that can emulate (for example) a snare sound
> as convincingly at least as a sample?  If so, these would be a good candidate to get a more
> live/real sound.  Most of the circuits I've looked at are rather simple, like pulse excited
> gyrators and enveloped noise stuff.
>
> Someone dry me off if I'm "all wet"...
>
> harrybissell at prodigy.net wrote:
> >My theory of drum 'feel' is that it is not randomization, but
> >very subtle phase shifting of the drum hits with respect to the
> >absolute (correct) beats.
> >
> >If you play a snare drum just a shade AHEAD of the actual beat, you get
> >a very energetic 'rock and roll' sound. Tempo is not affected and there
> >is not a random distribution causing the effect.
> >
> >Play a shade after the beat and the effect becomes laid-back, bluesy,
> >etc.
> >
> >I try to instruct my drummers (when its not me...) to play on the front
> >edge of the beat, or stay on the back edge of the beat to achieve
> >different feels. Most times this results in them increasing or
> >decreasing tempo (ie they'rs not getting it). You CAN experiment
> >using sampled sounds and a good sequencer like Cakewalk... to
> >slide a snare or hi-hat track just a millisecond early or late,
> >without moving tempo. Slight 'random' differences in timbre are
> >very helpful... and I like to layer cymbals and have higher
> >velocities trigger samples that are detuned down slightly. Try
> >that too... H^) harry > >On Wed, 18 Dec 2002, Richard Wentk
> >wrote: >> >Randomize the quantisation of drum machines to get a
> >human touch ? >> >As if a good drummer would play around the beat
> >at random! >> Agree with you on that one. That approach has
> >always been really - uh - >> random. :) >> But be fair - it is a
> >great way to simulate a really bad drummer. :) > I remember the
> >thread on this a while back. Perhaps a more >productive approach
> >might be to slightly vary the amplitude of >the impact, rather
> >than (or along with) the tempo. I suspect >that timing is more of
> >a matter of psychology and coordination >than physical ability,
> >and that a competent(!) drummer may be >better able to keep on
> >tempo than to ensure that each beat >sounds the same; muscle
> >fatigue, small changes in position, >and many other factors can
> >affect the speed and force of the >impact. Maybe it's a bogus
> >theory, but I believe that's a >significant "humanizing" element
> >electronic drums lack. >-- >--Robert Kent > hanuman at ccsi.com
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