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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>True, some of the personality and 'grit'
of FM (and even wavetable stuff) can be lost with filtering; but you don't
necessarily have to use a LPF, and you don't necessarily have to use it
all the time. Some FM stuff just gives you 'raw material' for your
VCF that you wouldn't normally get with standard subtractive synthesis. I
would think a DX-7 or even a CZ-101 would sound pretty neat through something
like Cynthia's </span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Quad</span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Low</span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Pass</span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> gate. Also, I thought my CZ-101 sounded pretty neat through the
VCF on my Odyssey. Crank up the resonance or overdrive the VCF for a whole new
bag of neat sounds.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Tim (angels advocate?) Servo</span></font></p>
<div>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><em><i><font size=3 color=blue
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:blue'>"Imagination
is more important than knowledge." - Albert Einstein</span></font></i></em></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Rude 66</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
[mailto:r.lekx@chello.nl] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, February 17, 2004
3:35 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> philgallo@attglobal.net; '</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Cynthia
Webster</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'>'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> synth diy<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [sdiy] Yamaha DXy
DCO's</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>to be honest, i find the aliasing and noise from an fm synth adds to
its timbre and personality. just like early digital can give certain drum
sounds that extra 'something'. especially in bass sounds, you can really make a
dx synth sound nasty. filtering will pretty much remove that..</span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>r./</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>(always the devils advocate..;-)</span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 3.0pt;
margin-left:3.0pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>----- Original Message ----- </span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:philgallo@attglobal.net" title="philgallo@attglobal.net">phillip m
gallo</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:cynthia.webster@gte.net" title="cynthia.webster@gte.net">'Cynthia
Webster'</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:synth-diy@dropmix.xs4all.nl" title="synth-diy@dropmix.xs4all.nl">synth
diy</a> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> Wednesday,
February 18, 2004 12:02 AM</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> RE: [sdiy] Yamaha
DXy DCO's</span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Cynthia,</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Filters are a natural for Dx kind of FM
(as well as analog FM). As the FM technique generates freq.
side bands both above and below the sounding Frequency bandpass
and high pass filters demonstrate increased effectiveness.
Also because FM provides another form of timbral
"dynamism", filter techniques long considered boringly
standard, sound new working in contrast or in concert with the dynamism
occurring upon the DCO, this leads to a complexity of sound that moderates and
enhances the timbral palette resulting from FM.</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>I'm looking forward to the SDIY meet and
will surely bring the DCO's to play with.</span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>regards,</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>p</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> Cynthia Webster
[mailto:cynthia.webster@gte.net] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, February 17, 2004
2:32 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> philgallo@attglobal.net; synth
diy<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [sdiy] Yamaha DXy
DCO's</span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Hi Phil!<br>
<br>
The recent thread comparing DX7 and Buchla FM synthesis <br>
techniques pondered the use of Analog Filters on Digital <br>
FM Oscillators as something worthwhile to play with.<br>
<br>
This reminded me of the experience that I had when<br>
you brought your Yamaha DCO board to a SciSound<br>
meeting. I was rather amazed at the quality of the sounds <br>
when no filters at all were involved.<br>
<br>
Being a total filter junkie myself, I was humbled by the <br>
filtered types of sounds that you were getting without any.<br>
<br>
So naturally, I would love to hear that wonderful DCO<br>
combination through a juicy analog filter like the (4-pole)<br>
Nyle Steiner design!<br>
<br>
Maybe we'll finally get to try this at Jim Patchell's next <br>
DIY meet? (March 27th same location as last year)<br>
<br>
It is so odd that folks with fairly large systems typically <br>
seem to dedicate only a single filter to each "voice"<br>
(when it get far more interesting when multiple filters <br>
are involved) <br>
<br>
Clever use of Digital Oscillators suggests that if some <br>
of the "filtering" is done without filters...<br>
then some total magic may be possible when they're <br>
combined with um, (forgive me)... The real thing!<br>
<br>
There are some keyboard synths that combine the two, <br>
anyone care to share their experiences here?<br>
<br>
Cyn<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
on 2/17/04 12:26 PM, phillip m gallo at philgallo@attglobal.net wrote:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
</span></font><font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Posts regarding
polyphony so far have only dealt with multiple "like" voice channels.
There is more to polyphony than implementing this way.
Polyphonically driving multiple "different" voices
is a very potent technique. It does require a more sophisticated
"Note control".</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>As an example, in my pre-MIDI
days, i built a controller which drove 9 Yamaha DXy DCO's with my SDIY modular
tracing the highest key (descant) , and my MG-1 tracing the lowest key(basso).
The DXy's where given all notes but even here i did not program the DCO's
to have the same voice. This was a digital implementation of what i had
done in an analog way with a Lancaster Poly and the two synths.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>This technique provides a
really interesting ensemble effect that resulted in two "performance"
characteristics:</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>1)</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>You playing stop's being
pianistic or organ-tuan but becomes very precise as notes allocate to
"voicings" and repeatability requires precise technique,</span></font>
<br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>2)</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Alternatively, pianistic
playing resulting in very cool ad hoc voice assignment which provided a
"uncertainty" to the "orchestration" which had the
dangerous side effect of keeping you playing the synth way past bed time and
bending your orchestrational "ear". Reminded me of the insite
gained from playing a "prepared piano".</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Now MIDI make all this very
easy. Your M2CV needs to have rules in it for not to voice assignment, an
example being how to detect new voice activations vs. "overlap"
between key activations. Since MIDI provide velocity information as well
as channel info it's pretty easy to make decisions as to voice allocation.
You do need to provide a buffer for key's pressed but not presently
assigned to help govern these rules. <br>
</span></font><br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>I have always disliked the
rotary note assignment that poly synths often do and am sure this is a major
contributor to polysynths sounding like really neat but non-the-less organ-like
instruments.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>regards,</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>p</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>-----Original Message-----</span></font>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>From:
owner-synth-diy@dropmix.xs4all.nl [<u><font color=blue><span style='color:blue'>mailto:owner-synth-diy@dropmix.xs4all.nl</span></font></u>]
On Behalf Of Grant Richter</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Sent: Tuesday, February 17,
2004 10:37 AM</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>To: Rainer Buchty; Andalong
Dudigual</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Cc:
synth-diy@dropmix.xs4all.nl</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>Subject: Re: [sdiy] poly?</span></font>
<br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>> Now for the fake
solutions:</span></font> <br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>> <br>
> The cheapest way to turn a monophonic synth into some sort of</span></font>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>> polyphonic machine is the
arpeggiator. Works nicely with chords, but <br>
> is rather unusable for true polyphonic play.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>My electronic music teacher
(Dr. August Wagner) pointed out that echo devices like the Echoplex allow you
to achieve polyphony with a mono-synth by layering in real time. It was one
reason they were so popular to use with early synths.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>He also pointed out that
electronic instruments are the only ones without inherent acoustic ambience,
which all acoustic instruments have. Hence electronic reverb is practically an
essential for imitative synthesis.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>This was in response to my
comment that using effects units with synthesizers was "cheating".
His response was that, not only was it not "cheating", but imperative
for the above reasons.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>I know that is not what the
original poster intended. But I thought they were rather keen insights on his
part (and for 1976). He died very young, and I try to keep his memory alive in
some small way.</span></font> </p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
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